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Post by beefmonger on Sept 23, 2006 19:57:20 GMT -5
I've had a really great friend for a while, but the problem is that he's agnostic. One time I just couldn't take it anymore and finally confronted him about it. We had a debate for a while and eventually he just said he had to leave (isn't it funny how the one pushing his religion never suddenly "has to go?") and that kinda dissappointed me. We just kept throwing back questions and answers (I was answering his questions most of the time), but it never really went anywhere. He just absolutely refused to accept that I might actually be right. I guess he's just scared he'll have to give up his porn or something :S Anyways, the point of this thread was to ask you guys how to show people the truth. I read in a great book (Blue Like Jazz by Donald Miller) that what got a friend of his (the author) to finally accept the truth from him was that he wasnt trying to "sell" his religion. He said the friend really liked that the person trying to convert them "sounded like they talked to God that morning on the phone." This sounded all nice and dandy to me, but I never truly understood what he meant by "sounding like they talked to God on the phone." I thought maybe you guys could give me an example of a conversation that someone might have where the person sounds like they talked to God on the phone that morning. And if you can't give me that, please try to give me some advice for converting people and maybe some stories about instances where you've gotten people to come to know Christ (if you have any). Thank you for your time.
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Post by Kirke on Sept 24, 2006 7:27:28 GMT -5
You can be extremely familiar with the Scriptures so you may have a ready defence for every question or attack he presents. You can teach and speak the truth in love. You already seem to love your neighbor as yourself!
Most of all you can live like Christ. Our language, actions, deeds, goals, dreams, hopes, communication, thoughts, and apperance must all reflect Christ, or to any thinking man we appear quite rightly as hypocrites.
The Bible says that is what you can do. You can love this fellow, you can speak to him about the truth, and you can live turning the other cheek and serving. Past that, it is not up to you to do anything. God will do what God will do.
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Post by beefmonger on Sept 24, 2006 13:11:15 GMT -5
Well, I had an answer to every question he asked, but no luck. I guess it's just as you said, "Past that, it is not up to you to do anything. God will do what God will do." But I'm still extremely curious as to what Donald meant when he said someone sounded liek they talked to God on the phone that morning *scratches head* Thanks for your help, though.
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Post by Kirke on Sept 24, 2006 20:14:06 GMT -5
I wouldn't worry about it too much. Talking to God on the phone isn't possible, nor is personal extraScriptural revelation necessary.
I am not sure if your friend meant "talking to God on the phone" in the sense of talking to God as he would a normal person or not. I would assume not. Biblically, talking to God in any form (Be it the Father in the Old Testament, the Spirit's visions, or the physical lips of Christ) is not like talking to anyone else.
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Post by steel_lily on Sept 24, 2006 23:04:07 GMT -5
Pardon Mr. Super. He lacks a bent for the poetic.
"Talking to God on the phone"....The nearest relevant meaning to draw from this is that the man sounded as if he knew exactly what he was talking about with his faith, and was ready to exemplify it in his life. There are times that words will come out of the mouths of humans, but ring with the voice of God. For example, the Bible was all written by human hands, from human words. Yet it tells us that it is the inspired and unique work of God. God had to have spoken through the authors in order for this to be true. So, to use the phrase, the human authors of the Bible sound as if they had spoken to God on the phone that morning. Not that there were phones.
Hope that explained things a bit.
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Post by Kirke on Sept 25, 2006 9:42:13 GMT -5
You might also mention the point than when "agnostic" is literally translated into Latin, it comes out as "ignoramus"...
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Post by steel_lily on Sept 25, 2006 11:44:32 GMT -5
Please define "arrogant", "boorish", and "shallow"?
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Post by st1_Emrys on Sept 25, 2006 14:49:50 GMT -5
ouch... lets keep it cool now guys.
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Post by beefmonger on Sept 25, 2006 16:29:19 GMT -5
You might also mention the point than when "agnostic" is literally translated into Latin, it comes out as "ignoramus"... ROFLCOPTERS! That's hilarious! But that would just make him angry and never want to touch the subject with me again. I already came extremely close to that and it scared the crap outa me... I'm still a little confused about the talking on the phone thing :S He was using the term side-by-side with hating it when people try to "sell" God to people, so I would think they have something to do with eachother, but I very well could be wrong. Please define "arrogant", "boorish", and "shallow"? Am I missing something?
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Post by Alameth of the Iron Fist on Sept 26, 2006 8:28:51 GMT -5
Yes. Don't worry about it.
To the involved: Please. I've asked before.
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Post by Kirke on Sept 26, 2006 10:56:02 GMT -5
Another strong thing, my friend, is to just ignore the subject if it's not worth spending any more time talking about. If the man is insistent on his viewpoint, you won't change him. God can, you can't.
A lot of times it just make sense to ignore people when they're not promoting anything worthwhile, and to avoid pressuring people to change when it's very obvious they don't want to change. Show them love; but what if there's another person who does want to change that you could be talking to instead?
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Post by Middle Earth Mouse on Sept 26, 2006 13:34:03 GMT -5
It means having such a close intimate relationship with God that you start acting like Him in ways that, while they may not recognize it, they will instinctively know that you are a christian and your faith is real.
People, never make this site free, never. I read the "adds by google" to get an idea of what is in the thread if I didn't have time to read all of it but had something to say to a particular post (I did read all of this thread) and just to see if there's anything interesting in it. one such came up for this thread: "Life in God". Become so much like God that if you lived in Him there would be no change in you(or at least no noticeable change), only in the world around you. "...You are the light of the world. A city located on a hill cannot be hidden..." ~Matthew 5:13 in-an-odd-translation, or-at-least-one-I'm-not-familiar-with. Try to become so much like God that you are like a city on a hill, unable tobe hidden.
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Post by beefmonger on Sept 26, 2006 18:00:39 GMT -5
Valid points. I guess like Superman said, I just have to let God do His work and like Mousy basically said, I have to worry about myself and be more like God.
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Post by Kirke on Sept 26, 2006 22:17:36 GMT -5
Oh, brother, don't worry about doing better! Just do better and skip the worrying. Tomorrow worries about itself. -winks- You save time and effort!
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Post by beefmonger on Sept 27, 2006 0:24:45 GMT -5
Heh, yes, well, if I'm not concerned, I'll never get better
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Post by Kirke on Sept 28, 2006 0:01:05 GMT -5
And if all you are is concerned, you'll still never get better. -grins-
You get the point, brother, and I see what you're saying. Concern to do what is right, find what is right, do it. We agree, yes?
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Post by beefmonger on Sept 28, 2006 16:58:50 GMT -5
Yes, I'm pretty sure we do =^)
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